I'm very happy today to be speaking with Xavier Lavagetto. And we are going to be talking about love, of course, because this is what the class is all about, but particularly in the context of Christianity. And so I look forward very much to hearing how you might define the term love, how it's expressed in your particular religion, and anything else you would like to speak about. Not exactly a small topic, because love has so many dimensions. You can talk about agape, which is that self-giving love. You can talk about storge, that natural affection; then philia, which is friendship, and eros, that, you know, is erotic love. And all of them, all of them, all of them are essentially good, okay? Is essentially good. In this sense, we know we really do kind of stand on the shoulders of our Jewish forebears. Why? Because we really take very much to heart that God created a world and that world is-- seven times said he saw it was good. And the last time, he says it was Tov Meod - it was very good. And so, they have that positivity about the whole of creation, I think, is essential. Number one. I think number two, God calls by name. God gives a name. So, there's this incredible kind of reverence for the person, but a person which also has mission and purpose. Judaism was interesting in this. It's not a cyclical religion, but history has a directionality to it. And so, that gives the individual a role in the larger community, in the whole of creation as fitting together, as a fitting together. Now, we introduce all kinds of brokenness into the whole thing. And one of the things, let's face it, every religion will talk about God or whatever the supernaturals as being merciful and kind. Then, humanity goes and blows every time. But nonetheless, that aspiration, that deepest call of our heart is really, we believe, it's God's voice and calling, that somehow in us the creator is reflected. That we are truly in this Genesis, in the image and likeness of God. Now, if I had to give kind of a one word, phrase definition, I'd say is, "Willing the good of the other." And that is a decision, it's an act of will. Sometimes, we will simply keep love as at the feeling level, and that is all good. But it only really becomes real, consistent, and growing when I truly, truly desire the good of another human being. That's a commitment, a decision I have to make. It is not something that I fall upon. You might say we fall in love, but we rise in agape, as one writer put it. I thought so lovely phrase, this idea of self-giving love. Maybe the point of it really begins actually in the uniquely Christian insight of Trinity, where we really say God is love. And it's the only kind of definition that we really kind of allow God really. And if you think about that just for a moment, that in this trinity of persons, from all eternity before there is anything, God is a simple simple passionate love. A Father expressing himself that word returning that love and that breath is the spirit. So, God is inherently pure act, pure relationality. And out of the enthusiasm of love, because love loves to love, God creates an incredible universe, or maybe it's a multiverse. Let's not ever put a cap on what God's creativity can lead to. And then, we're called to enter into that relationship with that kind of love. And that's a decision I have to make, and I have to make it concrete. And in that sense, it very much comes also from Judaism. You did it by action. Love was, I think in many respects, an act you did. It was always to become real and concrete. And so, you have love of neighbor wasn't just some kind of emotive feeling. And maybe, for our society and our world, Judaism which nature of neighbor was at first much more circumscribed, you know, in the tribe, in the village. Okay. They extended it much more widely saying, ''The alien who dwells among you shall be as a citizen. You shall love the alien as yourself, for once, you were aliens in the land of Egypt.'' So you have this kind of growing universalism of care and concern in Judaism, and Christianity simply embraces that totally. I think Christianity probably has another sense that creation itself is part of the process, that creation is longing as longing itself. And so, the ultimate vision is God be all in all - that's St. Paul's word. With that point, what is left out? See sometimes, we kind of slip into a dualistic thinking: there is good for the good God and an evil God. But of Christianity and Judaism are monotheisms. Ultimately, the creation at its core is totally good. We can go meandering in a way, we can do all kinds of terrible things, I mean talk about even in the spiritual realm. But I think, you know, part of the process is well then how do I, in fact, look not toward myself but toward the others to become a gift of self to the other? Now ultimately though, in saying that love is willing the good for the other, it doesn't stop there. It isn't just this one way kind of action. There is, I believe, another aspect which I mentioned, love loves to love. There is always a receiving if only in our delight in loving. But then number three, to form a communion, to form a union. Okay? So, it's not to leave out anything but, in fact, to reincorporate and reconnect everything. And in connecting with your neighbor, we're talking about coming alive and that takes growth. It takes reflection. It takes kind of facing the truth and moving beyond the truth of ourselves to a greater truth. So, I think, you know, ultimately that's why we say, you know, love ultimately is the person, who is a real person. And so therefore, it has to be a relational activity going on. When you say that the person is on a journey toward God, are you in that sense also saying the person is on a journey toward love? Yes. And, does that mean that love, in fact, is the central concept? Yes. Hundred percent. It's therefore when we see acts, acts of violence and neglect. I was just about to ask if God is good and we're seeking union, why do we have so many really bad situations, war, violence? Yes, because we can be really selfish and egotistical, can we? We can choose it for ourselves. And finally, when the one uncoercible act is your act of deciding to love. Okay. To will the good of the other. That's a decision you make and therefore, requires us to have freedom. And so, that freedom is a terrible freedom. It can be incredibly noble and beautiful, and it can be just totally demonic and it's that act of freedom. Now, the traditional answer, ''Then why does God permit it?'' is because in not permitting it, you would do a worse evil. In other words, evil's the privation of good. And this sense, if God really made us incapable of evil, then we've been also incapable of really loving, being a gift - that gift of love. So, there is a cost. There is a cost to say, ''I want love to be at the core.'' The terrible cost. And so therefore, we have to keep on inviting, keep on inviting. God permits because to do so, if we were making the universe totally without pain, then in fact, it would be a very cold universe. A dad called me one day and said, "My son just asked me, why does God allow all this terrible stuff to occur?" And I said, "Let me get this straight. Let me just get this straight. What you're really saying to me is that any time you directly or indirectly say, do, anything which might hurt or impinge on another human being, you want God to stop you." And the silence. Thank God. He had deep breathing because I know if the line hadn't gone dead. And then very-- it was a good minute, two minutes, there was a very kind of soft voice that said, "No, I wouldn't. No, I wouldn't." So that, therefore, shouldn't tell us to be truly a yes to each other, to become the very goodness we aspire. Now, that's as soon as you can see this kind of switching around in the good Samaritan story. Now, with that lawyer says, ''Who's my neighbor? Who do I have to help? Who do I just simply got to do it no matter what?'' And so, Jesus tells the story about the man going down and those who passed him by. And then, finally the one who was the Samaritan, the hated Samaritan, reached out with an act of mercy, of mercy, of mercy. And said, "Who was neighbor? The one who showed mercy" And then, Jesus says, "Go and do likewise." In other words, he would say now there's going to a switch in the question. Not, ''Who is my neighbor that I have to help?'' But, ''Who can you become neighbor to?'' You create neighbor by being the neighbor to the other. And so therefore, you have that whole command, therefore, of enemy love, to love the enemy. Okay. To do good to those who harm you. And, yeah, many Christians just don't understand, don't choose it. Sometimes, I think because maybe they haven't let themselves be loved by God. In our world, we tend to think of justice as giving to each, each as due. That's one, you know possible definition. And what we see in the New Testament, when people are not retrojecting in American notion into it, we see that justice is always liberating. It's always something you pray for. It's something which frees. God's justice justifies the unjust. That's radical, you know, gift. And so at that point, where most people think of mercy as mitigation of justice, saving justice or restorative justice is a very current phrase. Its instrument is mercy, because I want to lift up, I want to lift up the other, I want to lift up the other. That's a good example where sometimes our culture overwhelms our religion, regretfully, regretfully. Too many people critique and view their religion through their politics. I think it should be the other way around. Our religion should be the critique of the politics. Because it sums us to a much higher goal and purpose. Today's reading, we talk about take up your cross and follow me. Now, some people want say that just about the sufferings hurt, you know, the pain of life and all the rest of that. No, no, no. Well, I become a criminal like Jesus. And crucifixion is capital punishment. And, you know, we all will go through these movements in our life where, for the sake of our value, we're going to, you know, hang on. And it's not comfortable. So, if we have what? You fall in love and you're in a loveless marriage, what do you do? You have the death of a child, what do you do? You're in a situation where you see friends, you know, African Americans in places where black lives don't matter, what do you do? How do you embrace that reality? Because finally, Catholics don't run away from suffering. If anything, we try embrace it. Not because we think God as some kind of ogre, but because finally, somehow we have to detoxify this world. So, maybe, you know, now we've got to make all this real. And so, for Catholic social teaching however, there are eight principles. If you really value a human being, you have a real radical sense of their dignity is primary. That's the foundational principle, and that everyone I should see the reflection of God's face. And that's going to decide all kinds of different medical, war, financial, all kinds of issues, if I really am committed to this person is the image and likeness of God. Number two, that we don't just exist by ourselves. We only become ourselves and discover ourselves in relationships. Therefore, the importance of family, community, an active participation in all venues of human life. And number three, that, yes, sometimes the Americans are great, I have this right, this is my right. I-- no, wait a minute, there's corresponding duties and without those sense of duties, we lose something. Okay? And among those rights are things sometimes that some people want to say, ''Well, hey in a libertarian society, you don't have.'' How about right to clean water, health care, food, shelter, clothing, medical care, that's all part of the package. If I really believe that person is a person of human dignity, then I owe that point because he's a reflection of myself. Okay? There is the special option for the poor and the vulnerable. A society, it is only measured by how it cares for its least fortunate. There's the values, dignity of work and the right of workers especially unionization, unions are being hammered now. But, if you want to reflect on the history and child labor which it conquered, one has to say, ''We owe a debt of gratitude.'' And if the worker is not at the table then eventually, we'll still be creating kind of an oligarchy. Solidarity, that sense that, hey, there's only one race called the human race. And that kind of interconnectedness. And finally, care for God's creation. This is home. You've got to take care of home because it takes care of us. Okay? So, those eight are our core. Traditionally, we spoke of them in different ways. We spoke about the spiritual corporal works of mercy and the ones people are most familiar of the corporal works, you know, feed the hungry, clothe the naked, give drink to the thirsty, clothe the naked, visit the imprisoned, visit the sick, bury the dead. You got to make love real. Otherwise, it's a nice feeling but it's not-- hasn't hit the road. Okay? Thank you so much for being here. I truly appreciate you taking the time.Thank you. My pleasure. Thank you for the honor. It's great.
