Alright, so we can understand termination and transformation as sometimes related in similar processes and even overlapping. But what are the key elements that are involved in, then, that kind of come up for a lot of people? >> So whether we're talking about a transformation or a termination, you know something has changed. And then, we will have to do something differently in order to address the same needs that were previously met by this relationship. Like say for example, if someone who is like a care provider of support, companionship, sense of intimacy just died, then I would have a lot of unmet needs, and being able to address those needs would be important. And as we talked about before the relationship has transformed. I may be going through a similar challenge, so many of my needs are not met now. Because of the change that has happened either in the relationship, in the external circumstances or in the person that I'm having a relationship with or like some changes within myself but the key thing still is that certain needs has not met and I would have to find new ways to address them. >> Okay, so that sounds very logical to me, just kind of going through this analysis and finding ways to meet our own needs, but when I think about termination or transformation within my own life, I think of a lot of emotion, like maybe I'm really happy, or maybe there's a lot of grief or sadness. And where do those fit in? >> Yeah, I think you're absolutely right in pointing out the emotional aspect. It's actually very important component of this process. Very often people get so emotional, right? That they would do things that are not helpful. It is not unusual for us to hear about people doing something to harm themselves. We also hear about people developing problems with like drinking or like substance use or other kinds of behaviours that are not helpful like you know gambling and other forms of self destructive behaviour. Some people get in trouble with the law. Some people actually develop severe mental health problems. So we really need to be paying attention to the emotional dimension of transformation and termination because relationships, as we know, can be so important, so central to a person's life. That losing a relationship or having a relationship that is severely disruptive can have huge emotional impact on our lives. >> All right. So you did mention that some people kind of react in these sort of self-destructive ways sometimes because of the high level of emotions that they experience. But how do you suggest just kind of for the average person how should they deal with their emotions? What do you think the process of going through those emotions should be like? >> I think the most important principle in this is self care. So to be able to care for oneself, a good starting point is for us to be very accepting of ourselves, including our own emotional reactions, right. So if I feel sad, I feel angry, I feel upset and even if my biorhythms are disturbed. I cannot sleep. I do not eat well or my menstrual cycle is off. I accept that this is a natural response to a significant event in life and I do not blame myself. I do not feel bad. I do not let myself fall into a vicious cycle of self-blaming. But taking a very positive attitude, okay, something happened. And I feel like shit and I want to take care of myself. How can I be nice to myself? Yes, I do feel angry. I feel jealous, or I feel this, I feel that. I may even feel suicidal, but I still want to take good care of myself. I think that is the first step, like that is self-acceptance and allowing yourself a lot of space to experience feelings and emotions. And not be threatened or intimidated by them.